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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carmine View Post
    Ryze is magic damage, and since his rework always builds tanky.
    This is true.

    I would say Cho'gath actually falls under this category as well.

  2. #12

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    Anyone notice the end where he said, "Featuring Lee sin the blind monk." I found that odd.

    Regardless, Rumble looks interesting but he isn't really a champion I plan on getting unless I have too much IP(if that possible)

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanJK View Post
    Anyone notice the end where he said, "Featuring Lee sin the blind monk." I found that odd.

    Regardless, Rumble looks interesting but he isn't really a champion I plan on getting unless I have too much IP(if that possible)
    There isn't anything to spend IP on if you own every champion and have all the runes you need.

    I saw a screen cap of Elementz with about 3100 RP and 13000 IP. Yeah. 13k.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carmine View Post
    Junk: Always a proponent of dumbing down the game. If you don't like the new champions, don't get them. Some of us actually like variety in champion styles though.
    you think this game is complicated or something? lol

    i just think they're trying too hard with their champions now. you don't need to release EVERY new champion with some type of twist. the 6 ability thing (activate it twice for another effect!) the new resource system...i mean when will they actually release another champ that uses rage/heat?? probably won't because it won't be original anymore!

    simple is better. not to say that rumble or any of those other champs are complicated, because they are not. they are trying to complicate things with their mechanics, but its still the same thing QWER but just different timing. so in the end the result is the same as a mana champ, except with that added gimmick to either have an excuse to jack the price or try to distract players from the severe lack of other additions (new maps etc)
    yes i know champion creation is completely separate from development like new maps, but i could honestly care less if they add 50 more new champions (all with a twist!). i'd rather see another map that promotes a different style of play or something.

    its just like the phase they went through of releasing champions with regurgitated abilities but updated and ultimately much better. the new champions are out shining the oldbies with their mechanics and basically do it all playstyle (tanky DPS with hard CC FTW!).
    it just sucks to see older champions being completely left in the wind because some newer champion can do it all + more and even better.

    if anything, release more burst/nuke champions, like a poppy, to help counter this tanky dps meta everybody is QQing about.
    Last edited by JunK; 04-26-2011 at 12:12 PM.

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    i just think they're trying too hard with their champions now. you don't need to release EVERY new champion with some type of twist. the 6 ability thing (activate it twice for another effect!) the new resource system...i mean when will they actually release another champ that uses rage/heat?? probably won't because it won't be original anymore!
    It's not very complicated. When you have the resource available, or at a certain level, the effect of an ability is simply stronger not something entirely different.

    I can see another Rage champion being developed but Heat is probably going to be specific to Rumble.

    As far as Rumble's spear ability is simply "You get a second cast for free."

    Alternate resource systems add variety to the game and give champions unique playstyles.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    they are trying to complicate things with their mechanics, but its still the same thing QWER but just different timing. so in the end the result is the same as a mana champ
    Edit: If the end result is the same, why does it even matter? "The same as a mana champ." Not better or worse than a mana champ. The same. I see no problem here.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    excuse to jack the price or try to distract players from the severe lack of other additions (new maps etc)
    The price doesn't change. 975 RP unless discounted. Maximum cost in IP is 6300.

    Edit: By the way, Rumble is only 4800 IP.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    yes i know champion creation is completely separate from development like new maps, but i could honestly care less if they add 50 more new champions (all with a twist!). i'd rather see another map that promotes a different style of play or something.
    We're supposed to get the new map in season 2. We'd all like to see new content, be it champions, items, or maps.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    its just like the phase they went through of releasing champions with regurgitated abilities but updated and ultimately much better. the new champions are out shining the oldbies with their mechanics and basically do it all playstyle (tanky DPS with hard CC FTW!).
    it just sucks to see older champions being completely left in the wind because some newer champion can do it all + more and even better.
    Most of the "best" champions are still the originals since release. (See: Ashe, Janna, Nunu, Corki, Rammus, Cho'gath, Alistar, Anivia, Twisted Fate. Just to list a few)

    Except Tanky DPS with hard CC is NOT ftw (See: CLG getting pubstomped by TIC and LLL)

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    if anything, release more burst/nuke champions, like a poppy, to help counter this tanky dps meta everybody is QQing about.
    Burst/nuke isn't how you counter tanky dps.
    Last edited by Synyster Spirit; 04-26-2011 at 01:21 PM.

  6. #16

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    It's not very complicated. When you have the resource available, or at a certain level, the effect of an ability is simply stronger not something entirely different.

    I can see another Rage champion being developed but Heat is probably going to be specific to Rumble.

    As far as Rumble's spear ability is simply "You get a second cast for free."

    Alternate resource systems add variety to the game and give champions unique playstyles.
    i know how rumble works, but its still a different effect...as in the skills differ (get strong is different than how they are normally).
    as far as rumbles spear ability, i wasn't specifically talking about him regarding the double skill proc, but ya...that one is included.

    Edit: If the end result is the same, why does it even matter? "The same as a mana champ." Not better or worse than a mana champ. The same. I see no problem here.
    it is the same, its just a gimmick to seem new, exciting and worst of all, 'skillful' (usually to jack the price of said champ)

    The price doesn't change. 975 RP unless discounted. Maximum cost in IP is 6300.

    Edit: By the way, Rumble is only 4800 IP.
    still higher than the champion average, which is probably why that tier was created to begin with. stop the QQ of 6300 yet still be expensive compared to majority.

    We're supposed to get the new map in season 2. We'd all like to see new content, be it champions, items, or maps.
    i just think they're running dry. by all means this game has plenty of replay value in itself and its already 9000 champions which can range in item builds etc. im not sure why riot thinks they need to release a new champion every 2 weeks and such. the game won't lose players if they don't release a new champ tomorrow, theres still plenty to play

    Most of the "best" champions are still the originals since release. (See: Ashe, Janna, Nunu, Corki, Rammus, Cho'gath, Alistar, Anivia, Twisted Fate. Just to list a few)
    uhh, it just seems like you're listing a bunch of champions and saying they are the best. i could do that too about newer champions.

    Burst/nuke isn't how you counter tanky dps.
    IMO it is. tanky DPS strive right now because they are tanky enough to take damage until they close the gap between the glass cannon DPS builds (ashe/corki/twitch etc). once they close that gap its all over because the glass cannon dies in a couple of seconds.
    even worse is all the CC/gap closers tanky DPS champions are getting. so not only can they tank enough to close the gap on their own, but now they can get in your face immediately, hard CC you and kill you within the time it takes to get them to half HP from your entire teams focus. (jarvan nocturne renekton etc).
    champions like ashe had the luxury of their distance and ability to kite champions such as udyr (an old tanky dps), but now the new releases are taking this luxury and slapping her in the face to the point of uselessness.

    however when i use a champion like poppy, for example, (one of the only pure nuke/burst champions in the game) i can literally kill ANY tanky DPS champion within 2 seconds, almost guaranteed.

  7. #17

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    I am a bit curious. How long have you been playing League and what account do you play under now?

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    i know how rumble works, but its still a different effect...as in the skills differ (get strong is different than how they are normally).
    as far as rumbles spear ability, i wasn't specifically talking about him regarding the double skill proc, but ya...that one is included.
    ... And? It's a different effect, that's great, you cant create champions without different effects. No one wants a game full of 10 Master Yis.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    it is the same, its just a gimmick to seem new, exciting and worst of all, 'skillful' (usually to jack the price of said champ)
    By that reasoning any new ability is just a gimmick to seem new. An aoe shield skillshot? Gimmick!

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    still higher than the champion average, which is probably why that tier was created to begin with. stop the QQ of 6300 yet still be expensive compared to majority.
    Pricing tiers are a good thing, without 6300 prices, people unskilled in the game would be commonly playing champions like Lee Sin and utterly failing. It is better to put more easily used champions at lower prices.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    i just think they're running dry. by all means this game has plenty of replay value in itself and its already 9000 champions which can range in item builds etc. im not sure why riot thinks they need to release a new champion every 2 weeks and such. the game won't lose players if they don't release a new champ tomorrow, theres still plenty to play
    Because it's how they make money. The game is free, they need to bring in profits somehow, besides, new champions keep the game fresh for many people once they have everything they need.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    uhh, it just seems like you're listing a bunch of champions and saying they are the best. i could do that too about newer champions.
    But he isn't. Ashe and Corki are the two best RDPS characters in the game right now, Ashe because of her utility and Corki because of his raw damage. They were both part of the original 40 champions and only received minor usability changes like the addition of Hawkshot to Ashe. Janna is incredible for her ability to counter initiations and has always been the best support in the game despite constant nerfs. Nunu is one of the best junglers in the game, and by far the best counter-jungler. Rammus has always been one of the best tanks in the game, and is also a good jungler and ganker. Cho'Gath has had to be nerfed lately because of how powerful he was. Alistar is at the forefront of the current roaming meta, and just received a rework that arguably buffed his already considerable power in this area. Anivia has constantly been considered one of the most powerful mages in the game because of her raw AoE damage and the utility her wall provides. Twisted Fate used to be god-mode a year ago and is still currently the best split pusher in the game, only rivaled by Shen. These are all part of the original 40 and have almost always been powerful. Your argument here is just plain wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by JunK View Post
    IMO it is. tanky DPS strive right now because they are tanky enough to take damage until they close the gap between the glass cannon DPS builds (ashe/corki/twitch etc). once they close that gap its all over because the glass cannon dies in a couple of seconds.
    even worse is all the CC/gap closers tanky DPS champions are getting. so not only can they tank enough to close the gap on their own, but now they can get in your face immediately, hard CC you and kill you within the time it takes to get them to half HP from your entire teams focus. (jarvan nocturne renekton etc).
    champions like ashe had the luxury of their distance and ability to kite champions such as udyr (an old tanky dps), but now the new releases are taking this luxury and slapping her in the face to the point of uselessness.

    however when i use a champion like poppy, for example, (one of the only pure nuke/burst champions in the game) i can literally kill ANY tanky DPS champion within 2 seconds, almost guaranteed.
    And again, you are just plain wrong. Tanky characters are especially designed to COUNTER burst. Burst characters like Annie and Poppy are incredibly cooldown reliant, and once they pop their first combo on someone it takes them a long time to regain their full power. Tanky characters can soak up this burst of damage then destroy the much more fragile caster. The best counter against tanky DPS is sustained damage characters like Heimerdinger or Ryze who's power never really wears out after their initial burst. They can keep doing large amounts of damage over time, it just isn't as frontloaded. Even then, lets say you are a burst caster like Veigar or Annie, you make the point that ranged characters have a luxury of distance, but your burst casters better have brought the tanky DPS in the red with their first burst or they are going to jump on you with their movement ability, a staple of tanky dps, not just added to characters since Xin Zhao. Characters like Singed, Jax, and Warwick have always had this ability to rapidly close distances. It is why characters like Ezreal, Tristana, Corki and Ashe all have abilities that keep their opponent away from them.

  9. #19

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    I don't feel like reading all the conflicts that JunK has encountered with people about LoL, but I feel that it is safe to say that every situation is JunK vs Strat division.

    LoL[Driuso]
    Singed ; Amumu kinda
    -


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  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carmine View Post
    And again, you are just plain wrong. Tanky characters are especially designed to COUNTER burst. Burst characters like Annie and Poppy are incredibly cooldown reliant, and once they pop their first combo on someone it takes them a long time to regain their full power. Tanky characters can soak up this burst of damage then destroy the much more fragile caster. The best counter against tanky DPS is sustained damage characters like Heimerdinger or Ryze who's power never really wears out after their initial burst. They can keep doing large amounts of damage over time, it just isn't as frontloaded. Even then, lets say you are a burst caster like Veigar or Annie, you make the point that ranged characters have a luxury of distance, but your burst casters better have brought the tanky DPS in the red with their first burst or they are going to jump on you with their movement ability, a staple of tanky dps, not just added to characters since Xin Zhao. Characters like Singed, Jax, and Warwick have always had this ability to rapidly close distances. It is why characters like Ezreal, Tristana, Corki and Ashe all have abilities that keep their opponent away from them.
    tanks are designed to counter burst, but 'tanky dps' champions are designed to counter the 'sustained dps' enough to get to their target and kill them. so im unsure how that is their counter...
    annie/veigar? i didn't mention them for good reason, they are hardly even burst champions now...only in basically perfect conditions. you did mention poppy, but the funny thing about her is by the time she has everything on CD her target is dead anyway (regardless of how tanky)

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